Why was Emmerdale never the success like other soaps?

[CAEF]

I know Corrie, EastEnders and Neighbours all once got on average 17-21 million an evening at one time. Yet Emmerdale never achieved such stellar figures and iconic status.

If Emmerdale got about 15 million it was seen as a big event, yet CS, EE and Neighbours regularly got 18-20 million or more.

I have a feeling that Emmerdale's rural setting is to blame. People tended to not prefer a soap set in a small village as opposed to a street, square or cul de sac.

Crossroads also got a stellar following. ITV bought in Home And Away to replace the slot left by Crossies but H&A never did match the figures Crossies once had. H&A was a bit of a white elephant as ITV wanted it to match Neighbours but it never came close.

[Holey]

I agree that used to be the case, but no longer as Emmerdale is more popular in terms of viewers than EastEnders. The ITV soaps tend to have more loyal viewers than EastEnders, perhaps that is because EastEnders has been in decline.

Up until 1988 Emmerdale was shown at different times in ITV regions and shut down for the summer until 1985 when it ran throughout the year.

[Deleted]

Emmerdale has lost it`s edge, no doubt about it. Although it still has its loyal viewers, it doesn't appeal to my anymore.
When the likes of Twig and Waaahron are shoved in our faces at any given opportunity, that`s when they turn off viewers in droves....including me.

[Teeks]

I think the rural setting certainly played a part in Emmerale's failure to achieve the kind of popularity that EastEnders and Corrie have enjoyed. People would often dismiss it as the "farm soap" or whatever as would I. I do believe most people (certainly working class people) find an urban setting more relatable because most of us grew up in a street community and still do. The countryside setting on Emmerdale takes a while to get accustomed to and I think the farming aspect was a turn-off. By taking the focus away from the farming and presenting Emmerdale as a 'normal soap' like its rivals, I think they were able to attract more viewers like me. I know some of the hardcore fans complain that the farming aspect is now non-existent, but I really do believe it has helped them pull in viewers who wouldn't normally watch Emmerdale.

However, the main reason I think Emmerdale has failed to achieve the same level of success as its rivals is simply because there was better soaps on TV throughout the early decades. I remember trying to watch Emmerdale in the late 90s and early 2000s and I found it almost unwatchable, I didn't like the acting and the storylines didn't really push the envelope like other soaps such as Brookside and EastEnders IMO. At the time, EastEnders was at its peak and made most soaps pale in comparison, so for me it was always difficult watching the "lesser soaps" because I was always constantly comparing the acting and storylines to the likes of EastEnders and Brookside, who tackled all sorts of gritty issues and challenged the viewers.

Nowadays, I don't think there's much of a difference in quality between the soaps - all of them have caught up to EastEnders and are in far better shape than them (well, except Hollyoaks). Of course, that's mainly down to EastEnders being in terminal decline for the last 10 years or so. That has helped Emmerdale to close the gap on its rivals and its viewership is now even bigger than EastEnders'. I doubt it'll ever match Corrie's viewership, though. Emmerdale is basically Corrie's little brother and ITV clearly favours the latter soap and will always put Corrie first, so you could argue Emmerdale has reached a glass ceiling of sorts. As long as ITV favour Corrie, Emmerdale will always be lagging behind.

That said, I do think in this current era, Emmerdale is the best soap on TV when it's at its best and, in that sense, you could argue it is now just as successful as Corrie and EastEnders. Unfortunately, the writers have become too obsessed with the Dingles these days, so it's becoming harder and harder for them to churn out good, quality material. The show is getting to the point where it needs a clear-out to restore some balance to the cast because the Dingle domination is starting to damage the storytelling and ruin its potential IMO.

[CAEF]

Yes, Emmerdale will always be second best to Corrie. If either Corrie or EastEnders had to be axed, I know for sure which one would get axed. The latter, as it is much younger whereas Corrie is part of the DNA of the UK culture.

[Holey]

It is quite interesting that Emmerdale has the older demographic when it comes to the audience. I also think Emmerdale has the best time slot out of the big 3 at 7.

It will be good to see what Kate Oates can achieve. I can see EastEnders gaining 2nd spot or at the very least fighting it out for 2nd place with Emmerdale. Neither soap will over take Corrie. I think Emmerdale sadly could be hitting the self destruct button.   Out of the 2 ITV soaps on balance Emmerdale is the better soap even in it's current state.

These things go in cycles,  I can see EastEnders rising from the ashes, but if it doesn't, this is EastEnders last throw of the dice with Oates, if it does not work, it will be the beginning of the end for the soap.  

[Teeks]

I agree. I don't think EastEnders will ever be able to recapture its former glory and overtake Corrie's ratings (unless something drastic happens to change their fortunes). That ship well and truly sailed when they killed off Dirty Den for a second time after hyping up his underwhelming return and falling completely flat. Any chance they had of getting back the viewers they lost were extinguished with Dirty Den's death. That and the fact they've killed off so many of their popular and legendary characters over the years such as Pauline & Mark Fowler, Pat & Frank Butcher, Steve Owen, Cindy Beale etc and leaving us with inferior characters - killing all those characters was bound to have an effect on their long-term viewership. The viewers were invested in those characters, many of us grew up with them. The producers only have themselves to blame for that as they've taken the popular characters for granted and arrogantly believed they could replace them with new characters.

When people watch EastEnders nowadays, they don't see many familiar faces anymore. It's nearly unrecogonisable to a viewer who watched EE in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s. Holey, you made a point earlier about how the ITV soaps have more loyal viewers and I think that's mainly down to Emmerdale and Corrie's cast members being around for decades and being familiar to viewers. Characters like Ken Barlow, Gail Platt, Eileen, Steve McDonald, David Platt, Cain & Charity are part of the furniture at these soaps and while many of those characters may not interest all the fans, many long-term viewers tune in for these familiar faces to greet them on their TV screens.

The cast turnover on EastEnders has been ridiculous over the years as well (only Hollyoaks axes more characters) - they keep chopping and changing characters every few years and don't give new characters the room to grow and develop gradually like Emmerdale and Corrie's characters (mind you, Emmerdale does have a slight problem with developing new characters whose surname isn't "Dingle" and devoting screentime to them). I remember my dad walking into the living room while I was watching EE at his house a few years ago, and he didn't even recognise any of the characters except for Sharon, Ian and Phil! He wasn't very interested in watching a soap that was full of strangers. The viewers have gradually lost interest and disengaged with EastEnders for this reason.

The show is currently struggling with an identity crisis of sorts because all the old classic characters who made EastEnders what it was are now dead or have left the show. The new characters haven't been able to fill the void left by the old guard, which is largely due to bad writing. So, in an attempt to remedy this, they keep bringing back old characters like Sharon, Kat, Alfie and Mel - but do nothing interesting with them and drag them down with repetitive plotlines. It's a vicious cycle. The show has lost its sparkle - it's x-factor. It doesn't have the same vibe to it anymore like it use to have in its golden era. The poor writing/storytelling is ultimately killing EastEnders and ensuring its decline. The storylines feel too watered down nowadays and even the fights/stunts aren't entertaining or realistic anymore.

The best Kate Oates can hope for at EastEnders is to regain 2nd spot from Emmerdale and try to build on that. She is facing a mammoth task to overtake Corrie, but if she can build a strong, durable cast for the next decade or so - then maybe one day they can compete with Corrie again? We'll see. But I have my doubts about that. The folks at the BBC are too trigger-happy. As soon as the next producer comes in - he or she will start swinging the axe and we'll be back to square one.

[CAEF]

Nov 12, 2018 0:42:28 GMT Teeks said:

I agree. I don't think EastEnders will ever be able to recapture its former glory and overtake Corrie's ratings (unless something drastic happens to change their fortunes). That ship well and truly sailed when they killed off Dirty Den for a second time after hyping up his underwhelming return and falling completely flat. Any chance they had of getting back the viewers they lost were extinguished with Dirty Den's death. That and the fact they've killed off so many of their popular and legendary characters over the years such as Pauline & Mark Fowler, Pat & Frank Butcher, Steve Owen, Cindy Beale etc and leaving us with inferior characters - killing all those characters was bound to have an effect on their long-term viewership. The viewers were invested in those characters, many of us grew up with them. The producers only have themselves to blame for that as they've taken the popular characters for granted and arrogantly believed they could replace them with new characters.

When people watch EastEnders nowadays, they don't see many familiar faces anymore. It's nearly unrecogonisable to a viewer who watched EE in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s. Holey, you made a point earlier about how the ITV soaps have more loyal viewers and I think that's mainly down to Emmerdale and Corrie's cast members being around for decades and being familiar to viewers. Characters like Ken Barlow, Gail Platt, Eileen, Steve McDonald, David Platt, Cain & Charity are part of the furniture at these soaps and while many of those characters may not interest all the fans, many long-term viewers tune in for these familiar faces to greet them on their TV screens.

The cast turnover on EastEnders has been ridiculous over the years as well (only Hollyoaks axes more characters) - they keep chopping and changing characters every few years and don't give new characters the room to grow and develop gradually like Emmerdale and Corrie's characters (mind you, Emmerdale does have a slight problem with developing new characters whose surname isn't "Dingle" and devoting screentime to them). I remember my dad walking into the living room while I was watching EE at his house a few years ago, and he didn't even recognise any of the characters except for Sharon, Ian and Phil! He wasn't very interested in watching a soap that was full of strangers. The viewers have gradually lost interest and disengaged with EastEnders for this reason.

The show is currently struggling with an identity crisis of sorts because all the old classic characters who made EastEnders what it was are now dead or have left the show. The new characters haven't been able to fill the void left by the old guard, which is largely due to bad writing. So, in an attempt to remedy this, they keep bringing back old characters like Sharon, Kat, Alfie and Mel - but do nothing interesting with them and drag them down with repetitive plotlines. It's a vicious cycle. The show has lost its sparkle - it's x-factor. It doesn't have the same vibe to it anymore like it use to have in its golden era. The poor writing/storytelling is ultimately killing EastEnders and ensuring its decline. The storylines feel too watered down nowadays and even the fights/stunts aren't entertaining or realistic anymore.

The best Kate Oates can hope for at EastEnders is to regain 2nd spot from Emmerdale and try to build on that. She is facing a mammoth task to overtake Corrie, but if she can build a strong, durable cast for the next decade or so - then maybe one day they can compete with Corrie again? We'll see. But I have my doubts about that. The folks at the BBC are too trigger-happy. As soon as the next producer comes in - he or she will start swinging the axe and we'll be back to square one.

Out of the 2 Aussie soaps, which do you think is the strongest and has the best characters? I say Neighbours. TBH I think Corrie, Emmerdale and Neighbours have the strongest formulas now.

[Teeks]

Nov 12, 2018 12:42:16 GMT CAEF said:

Nov 12, 2018 0:42:28 GMT Teeks said:

I agree. I don't think EastEnders will ever be able to recapture its former glory and overtake Corrie's ratings (unless something drastic happens to change their fortunes). That ship well and truly sailed when they killed off Dirty Den for a second time after hyping up his underwhelming return and falling completely flat. Any chance they had of getting back the viewers they lost were extinguished with Dirty Den's death. That and the fact they've killed off so many of their popular and legendary characters over the years such as Pauline & Mark Fowler, Pat & Frank Butcher, Steve Owen, Cindy Beale etc and leaving us with inferior characters - killing all those characters was bound to have an effect on their long-term viewership. The viewers were invested in those characters, many of us grew up with them. The producers only have themselves to blame for that as they've taken the popular characters for granted and arrogantly believed they could replace them with new characters.

When people watch EastEnders nowadays, they don't see many familiar faces anymore. It's nearly unrecogonisable to a viewer who watched EE in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s. Holey, you made a point earlier about how the ITV soaps have more loyal viewers and I think that's mainly down to Emmerdale and Corrie's cast members being around for decades and being familiar to viewers. Characters like Ken Barlow, Gail Platt, Eileen, Steve McDonald, David Platt, Cain & Charity are part of the furniture at these soaps and while many of those characters may not interest all the fans, many long-term viewers tune in for these familiar faces to greet them on their TV screens.

The cast turnover on EastEnders has been ridiculous over the years as well (only Hollyoaks axes more characters) - they keep chopping and changing characters every few years and don't give new characters the room to grow and develop gradually like Emmerdale and Corrie's characters (mind you, Emmerdale does have a slight problem with developing new characters whose surname isn't "Dingle" and devoting screentime to them). I remember my dad walking into the living room while I was watching EE at his house a few years ago, and he didn't even recognise any of the characters except for Sharon, Ian and Phil! He wasn't very interested in watching a soap that was full of strangers. The viewers have gradually lost interest and disengaged with EastEnders for this reason.

The show is currently struggling with an identity crisis of sorts because all the old classic characters who made EastEnders what it was are now dead or have left the show. The new characters haven't been able to fill the void left by the old guard, which is largely due to bad writing. So, in an attempt to remedy this, they keep bringing back old characters like Sharon, Kat, Alfie and Mel - but do nothing interesting with them and drag them down with repetitive plotlines. It's a vicious cycle. The show has lost its sparkle - it's x-factor. It doesn't have the same vibe to it anymore like it use to have in its golden era. The poor writing/storytelling is ultimately killing EastEnders and ensuring its decline. The storylines feel too watered down nowadays and even the fights/stunts aren't entertaining or realistic anymore.

The best Kate Oates can hope for at EastEnders is to regain 2nd spot from Emmerdale and try to build on that. She is facing a mammoth task to overtake Corrie, but if she can build a strong, durable cast for the next decade or so - then maybe one day they can compete with Corrie again? We'll see. But I have my doubts about that. The folks at the BBC are too trigger-happy. As soon as the next producer comes in - he or she will start swinging the axe and we'll be back to square one.

Out of the 2 Aussie soaps, which do you think is the strongest and has the best characters? I say Neighbours. TBH I think Corrie, Emmerdale and Neighbours have the strongest formulas now.

Definitely Neighbours at the moment. They did suffer a decline in quality at one point in the late 2000s and early 2010s and for a time I wondered if they would recover from it. But they now have a stable cast of characters again and the show feels entertaining and engaging again. The new additions to the Robinson, Brennan, and Kennedy families have revived the show. It's in a good state right now. EastEnders could learn a thing or two from Neighbours.

Home & Away has been declining badly since the Braxtons dominated the show. There's no strong family units anymore. I suppose the introduction of the Astonis and Morgans are a step in the right direction, but I don't know... they don't really interest me much. And they seem obsessed with crime storylines on H&A these days - even more so than Emmerdale! Sometimes I wonder if I'm watching a police crime drama and not a soap!

Yes. Corrie, Emmerdale and Neighbours are the strongest right now. The thing with Corrie is, even when it's in a bad state under a rubbish producer like Stuart Blackburn, it usually bounces back in style and improves under a new producer. They have such a strong, stable cast, so the show is never in danger of going into a state of flux like EastEnders has for the last 8 or 9 years.

[CAEF]

I think Channel 5 always seems to favour Neighbours over H&A as well. Neighbours gets more coverage on the channel than H&A does.

[Teeks]

Neighbours does seem to get more promotion on Channel 5 these days. I'd say that's down to Neighbours being the superior soap at the moment and being easier to market.

Home & Away's storylines aren't exactly enthralling these days. How do you promote it? Everything is so boring, derivative and crime-orientated. I can't think of a single good plotline on that show for a long time. It's a hard show to promote at the moment. 

[CAEF]

Trouble is, Emmerdale is now basically Dingledale. Even female non Dingles have married into the family and been Dingles at some point. Emily, Tricia, Laurel, Joanie. And men have married Dingles such as Jai, Dan, and even same sex with Robert Sugden and Aaron Dingle.

[Uncle Quentin]

Emmerdale will never be a success like Live Aid, be lucky if there's twenty people watching that shite next week.

Mind you, that's twenty people more than the 'peoples soap,' watching that f*cking London shite.


Ok, I'm done, Abba is on ...

[wallis]

Dec 14, 2018 22:06:44 GMT Uncle Quentin said:

Emmerdale will never be a success like Live Aid, be lucky if there's twenty people watching that shite next week.

Mind you, that's twenty people more than the 'peoples soap,' watching that f*cking London shite.


Ok, I'm done, Abba is on ...

Tut, tut, tut Unk. Don't make me angry with you.

If you respect my opinion on drama respect it on continuing drama (soap to you). 

[Holey]

Dec 14, 2018 22:17:58 GMT wallis said:

Dec 14, 2018 22:06:44 GMT Uncle Quentin said:

Emmerdale will never be a success like Live Aid, be lucky if there's twenty people watching that shite next week.

Mind you, that's twenty people more than the 'peoples soap,' watching that f*cking London shite.


Ok, I'm done, Abba is on ...

Tut, tut, tut Unk. Don't make me angry with you.

If you respect my opinion on drama respect it on continuing drama (soap to you). 

You have to make allowances Wallis and remember that many from Newport usually cover up their TV's with a table or dish cloth as not to get caught out by the TV detector vans for not paying their TV licence, so do not get to watch "BBC TV"  as we do. I do feel sorry for them. Bless.